How are Hinduism and Sikhism related, considering they both originated in Punjab, India?
11.06.2025 02:43
Gauree, Kabeer Jee, Panch-Padas:
I left Benares - I had little common sense. ||1|| Pause ||
Sain (a barber)
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You are totally pervading and permeating in all.
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ੴ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ ॥
Where millions of Shivas are lost in contemplation, where millions of Indras dwell in the sky,
ਕਹੁ ਕਬੀਰ ਇਹ ਕਹੀਐ ਕਾਹਿ ॥
I am not a Hindu, nor am I a Muslim.
Here ਨਿਰਗੁਣ is Nirgun and not just lord. This is just another example to show that Kabir himself continued in the NIRGUN BHAKTI path.
I would go there, only if the Lord were not here. ||2||
From Guru Granth Sahib ji - Ang 1195
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ਅਲਹ ਰਾਮ ਕੇ ਪਿੰਡੁ ਪਰਾਨ ॥੪॥
ਨਾ ਹਮ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਨ ਮੁਸਲਮਾਨ ॥
ਮਰਤੀ ਬਾਰ ਮਗਹਰਿ ਉਠਿ ਆਇਆ ॥੨॥
ਓਛੀ ਭਗਤਿ ਕੈਸੇ ਉਤਰਸਿ ਪਾਰੀ ॥੪॥
Kabeer: O worthless mortal, do not lose the Naam, the Name of the Lord.
So in the same spirit Kabir finds pilgrimages to holy cities futile as his mind is fixated on Rama!
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We have searched the turaki Dharam (Turk's religion, Islam), these teachers throw many thunderbolts,
Bhagat Kabir ji / Raag Sriraag / / Guru Granth Sahib ji - Ang 92
Now tell me, Lord, what will my condition be?
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He accepted even women (Sursuri and Padywati) as disciples. Bhagat Pipa and Dhanna were Rajput and Jat who were also his disciples.
ਜਿਨਿ ਸਕਲ ਬਿਕਲ ਭ੍ਰਮ ਕਾਟੇ ਮੋਰ ॥
Sant Kabir was staunchly against cow slaughter.
ਪੂਰਬ ਜਨਮ ਹਉ ਤਪ ਕਾ ਹੀਨਾ ॥੧॥
ਪੂਜਨ ਚਾਲੀ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਠਾਇ ॥
I went to God's place, and worshipped Him there.
What caused North Korea to go poor when at first it was rich?
Shvetashvatara Upanishad (6.23)
For many years, I practiced penance and intense meditation at Kaashi;
Let’s look at the most used verse by McSikhs to show that Sikhs are neither Hindus nor Muslims.
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I serve the One Lord, and not any other. ||2||
As long as the mind is filled with the desire for heaven,
Again we see that the originator of this Sant Sampraday himself talks about Brahman even in Gurbani.
What do you love to do at night when you’re alone?
My consciousness does not go out wandering. My mind has become crippled. ||1|| Pause ||
ਸੋ ਬ੍ਰਹਮੁ ਬਤਾਇਓ ਗੁਰ ਮਨ ਹੀ ਮਾਹਿ ॥੧॥
ਹਜ ਕਾਬੈ ਜਾਉ ਨ ਤੀਰਥ ਪੂਜਾ ॥
Why do women change that much more with age?
I do not perform Hindu worship services, nor do I offer the Muslim prayers.
ਏਕੋ ਸੇਵੀ ਅਵਰੁ ਨ ਦੂਜਾ ॥੨॥
Ramarchan Paddati gives more info about his teachings.
Do straight guys like to see cocks?
Wherever I go, I find water and stones.
Kabir, Ravidas and ultimately the NINE SIKH GURUS are a product of this very Sant Sampraday founded by Ramanandacharya!
ਰਾਮਾਨੰਦ ਸੁਆਮੀ ਰਮਤ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ॥
I have taken the One Formless Lord into my heart; I humbly worship Him there. ||3||
ਸਗਲ ਜਨਮੁ ਸਿਵ ਪੁਰੀ ਗਵਾਇਆ ॥
Let's look at the views of Sant Kabir
Kabir (a weaver)
We can understand that Kabir despite being in favor of formless worship was very much embedded in the Dharmik fold but always preached in the spirit of the transcendental nature of Brahman to the point that HE LOST THE DISTINCTION BETWEEN HINDU AND MUSLIM.
— Kabir, III.2, Translated by Rabindranath Tagore
Where spring, the lord of seasons reigneth, there the unstruck music sounds of itself,
Ravidas (a chamar shoemaker)
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That God showed me the Guru, within my own mind. ||1||
We can see that great saints like Kabir and Ravidas etc… descended from the Ramananda sampradaya which is still the largest ascetic order in India.
ਜਬ ਲਗੁ ਮਨਿ ਬੈਕੁੰਠ ਕੀ ਆਸ ॥
Actually, this part of the Ang 326 is widely used by McSikhs to show that Sikhism considers Hindu pilgrimages as useless and thus drives home the point again that the “religion” has got NOTHING to do with Hinduism.
ਰਾਮਾਨੰਦ ਸੁਆਮੀ ਰਮਤ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ॥
You have cut through all my confusion and doubt.
ਗੁਰ ਪੀਰ ਮਿਲਿ ਖੁਦਿ ਖਸਮੁ ਪਛਾਨਾ ॥੫॥੩॥
ਨਾ ਹਮ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਨ ਮੁਸਲਮਾਨ ॥
Where the demi-gods and the munis are unnumbered, where millions of Saraswatis, goddess of music play the vina,
ਮੁਆ ਕਬੀਰੁ ਰਮਤ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਰਾਮੈ ॥੫॥੧੫॥
ਏਕ ਦਿਵਸ ਮਨ ਭਈ ਉਮੰਗ ॥
ਜਿਉ ਜਲ ਛੋਡਿ ਬਾਹਰਿ ਭਇਓ ਮੀਨਾ ॥
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ਮੁਆ ਕਬੀਰੁ ਰਮਤ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਰਾਮੈ
Sikhism is a NIRGUN path descending from the Sant Sampraday of Ramanandacharya and traces its ideas to VEDANTA!
Where should I go? My home is filled with bliss.
ਬੇਦ ਪੁਰਾਨ ਸਭ ਦੇਖੇ ਜੋਇ ॥
Look within your heart, for there you will find both Karim and Ram;
ਬਹੁਤੁ ਬਰਸ ਤਪੁ ਕੀਆ ਕਾਸੀ ॥
then who is there to know what happens without?
Now that my time to die has come, I have come to dwell at Magahar! ||3||
If God be within the mosque, then to whom does this world belong?
ਕਹੁ ਕਬੀਰ ਇਹੁ ਕੀਆ ਵਖਾਨਾ ॥
At the time of my death, I moved to Magahar. ||2||
How can they kill the mother, whose milk they drink like that of a wet nurse?
ਗਉੜੀ ਕਬੀਰ ਜੀ ਪੰਚਪਦੇ ॥
— Kabir, Ramaini 1, Translated by David Lorenzen
Recklessly they display boundless pride while explaining their own aims, they kill cows.
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Raamaanand's Lord and Master is the All-pervading Lord God.
Here ਰਾਮੈ is Rama and not just lord. Kabir died chanting the name of Rama DESPITE him not finding any result of penances done in holy cities in his previous birth. Another example to show how much Kabir valued personal devotion to Rama in his own NIRGUN style.
Raamaanand's Lord and Master is the All-pervading Lord God.
For a superficial McSikh who is interested only in separation and not enlightenment the views of Kabir can be easily shown as a denouncement of Hindu practices.
I ground up sandalwood, along with several fragrant oils.
Bhagat Kabir ji / Raag Gauri / / Guru Granth Sahib ji - Ang 325
Bhakti movement began in South (Tamil Nadu to be precise) and slowly spread to Northern parts of India. This movement was extremely popular because of its simple fundamentals which could be understood by even commonfolk. Vaishnavism, Shaivism etc… were already connecting with commonfolk from a long time and this Bhakti movement reinforced it by making the devotee feel a personal connection with the deity.
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Hari is in the East, Allah is in the West.
I am a sacrifice to You, O my True Guru.
There is my Lord self-revealed, and the scent of sandal and flowers dwells in those deeps.
Says Kabeer, unto whom should I tell this?
CONCLUSION:
One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru:
ਕਹੁ ਗੁਰ ਗਜ ਸਿਵ ਸਭੁ ਕੋ ਜਾਨੈ ॥
Guru Nanak (right) and Bhai Mardana (foreground) with Bhagat Kabir (left). This painting is found in the B-40 Janamsakhi, written and painted in 1733. The painting was made by Alam Chand Raj
One day, a desire welled up in my mind.
— Kabir, II.57, Translated by Rabindranath Tagore
For him Dharma was beyond everything physical including the desire for heaven because was fully into the NIRGUN . The last verse shows that according to him the company of the enlightened Sadhus is heaven which is again a typical teaching of Sanatana Dharma.
Kabir is the child of Allah and of Ram: He is my Guru, He is my Pir.
ਏਕ ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰ ਲੇ ਰਿਦੈ ਨਮਸਕਾਰਉ ॥੩॥
I do not make pilgrimages to Mecca, nor do I worship at Hindu sacred shrines.
ਕਬੀਰ ਨਿਰਗੁਣ ਨਾਮ ਨ ਰੋਸੁ ॥
With inadequate devotion, how can anyone swim across? ||4||
Ramananda accepted disciples without discriminating against anyone by gender, class or caste and they included even people from humble origins like
The divergence of Kabir’s views from Vedanta is seen in the fact that he fully opposed religious symbolism of ALL KINDS and not just IDOLS.
As mentioned above Guru Arjan Dev was talking from the perspective Sant Kabir whose views we have discussed much earlier here. We know that Sant Kabir continuing in the Ramanandi Sampradaya went further away from the mainstream ritualistic Hinduism and was journeying more towards a SEAMLESS Dharma.
He who has highest Bhakti of Deva (God), just like his Deva, so for his Guru (teacher),
ਜਹਾ ਜਾਈਐ ਤਹ ਜਲ ਪਖਾਨ ॥
Bhagat Kabir ji / Raag Gauri / / Guru Granth Sahib ji - Ang 325
ਕਤ ਜਾਈਐ ਰੇ ਘਰ ਲਾਗੋ ਰੰਗੁ ॥
Where millions of Vishnus bow their heads, where millions of Brahmas are reading the Vedas,
ਪੂਜਾ ਕਰਉ ਨ ਨਿਵਾਜ ਗੁਜਾਰਉ ॥
I am like a fish out of water,
ਤਬ ਲਗੁ ਹੋਇ ਨਹੀ ਚਰਨ ਨਿਵਾਸੁ ॥੩॥
How can people understand You, when they are entranced by Maya? ||1|| Pause ||
The Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy, is heaven. ||4||10||
ਮਰਨੁ ਭਇਆ ਮਗਹਰ ਕੀ ਬਾਸੀ ॥੩॥
Without looking into one's heart, how can one reach paradise?
I wasted my whole life in the city of Shiva;
The influence of Kabir is significant on Sikhism. The following Bani from Ang 1136 is attributed to GURU ARJAN DEV but if you observe at the end you can see that he was talking in the spirit of Sant Kabir.
Ramanandacharya was a 14th-century Hindu Vaishnava devotional poet saint who amalgamated Advaita with Vaishnava Bhakti. He was the pioneer in validating NIRGUN and SAGUN Bhakti as parallel paths.
NOW…
Meeting with the Guru, my Spiritual Teacher, I realize God, my Lord and Master. ||5||3||
ਕੈਸੇ ਬੂਝੈ ਜਬ ਮੋਹਿਆ ਹੈ ਮਾਇਆ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
If Ram be within the image which you find upon your pilgrimage,
Let’s see what Gurbani has about Ramanandacharya’s views.
Says Kabeer, this is what I say:
ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਮੈ ਬਲਿਹਾਰੀ ਤੋਰ ॥
There is a reason why I mention ROOTED and thus NOT implying that it belongs to one of the numerous sects in Sanatana Dharma like Shaivism, Vaishnavism, Shaktism, Smartism etc…
Ramanandacharya’s teachings were centered on pure and personal connection with the God Rama and didn’t believe in any kind of formal ritualism. He used the common vernacular language instead of Sanskrit so that everyone could understand.
The views of Kabir are very much in parallel to the Advaita philosophy and it is obvious that as the disciple of Ramanandacharya he will carry forward with his chosen NIRGUN BHAKTI.
ਮੇਰਾ ਚਿਤੁ ਨ ਚਲੈ ਮਨੁ ਭਇਓ ਪੰਗੁ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
Because in my previous life, I did not practice penance and intense meditation. ||1||
ਕਾਸੀ ਮਗਹਰ ਸਮ ਬੀਚਾਰੀ ॥
Sadhna (a Muslim butcher) and
I am not a Hindu, nor am I a Muslim.
Raamaanand Jee, First House:
Says Kabeer, the Guru and Ganaysha and Shiva all know
I have searched through all the Vedas and the Puraanas.
All the men and women of the world are His living forms.
The Sant Sampraday of Sikh panth integrates the warrior spirit of the Nihangs and Khalsa, the service of Seva panth and the renunciation of Udasi/Nirmala saints.
Sikhism is fundamentally rooted in BHAKTI tradition and thus ultimately in Sanatana Dharma. There is no doubt about it despite what modern McSikh acrobatics try to claim otherwise
ਅਬ ਕਹੁ ਰਾਮ ਕਵਨ ਗਤਿ ਮੋਰੀ ॥
The young and the old drink milk pudding, but these fools eat the cow's body.
The Word of the Guru's Shabad eradicates the karma of millions of past actions. ||3||1||
Bhagat Kabir ji / Raag Gauri / / Guru Granth Sahib ji - Ang 326
There, where millions of Krishnas stand with hands folded,
My body and breath of life belong to Allah - to Raam - the God of both. ||4||
ਰਾਮਾਨੰਦ ਜੀ ਘਰੁ ੧
ਬ੍ਰਹਮ is Brahm i.e the Brahman of vedanta but it gets interpreted as an all-pervading lord god.
ਸਾਧਸੰਗਤਿ ਬੈਕੁੰਠੈ ਆਹਿ ॥੪॥੧੦॥
ਊਹਾਂ ਤਉ ਜਾਈਐ ਜਉ ਈਹਾਂ ਨ ਹੋਇ ॥੨॥
There the streams of light flow in all directions, few are the men who can cross to that shore!
ਤੂ ਪੂਰਿ ਰਹਿਓ ਹੈ ਸਭ ਸਮਾਨ ॥
ਘਸਿ ਚੰਦਨ ਚੋਆ ਬਹੁ ਸੁਗੰਧ ॥
These morons know nothing, they wander about in ignorance,
ਗੁਰ ਕਾ ਸਬਦੁ ਕਾਟੈ ਕੋਟਿ ਕਰਮ ॥੩॥੧॥
He does not dwell at the Lord's Feet. ||3||
यस्य देवे परा भक्तिः यथा देवे तथा गुरौ । तस्यैते कथिता ह्यर्थाः प्रकाशन्ते महात्मनः प्रकाशन्ते महात्मन इति ।
To him who is high-minded, these teachings will be illuminating.
ਤਜੀ ਲੇ ਬਨਾਰਸ ਮਤਿ ਭਈ ਥੋਰੀ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
That Kabeer died chanting the Lord's Name. ||5||15||
Now here in this verse
But we have actually seen how much Kabir is also rooted in the Vedantic concept of “supreme realization” but in a non-mainstream path.
Kaashi and Magahar - I consider them the same.
From where did the word Maya come? Isn’t it a typical Vedantic concept discussed profoundly in Advaita? It definitely isn’t a concept pioneered by Kabir or even his teacher Ramanandacharya! It is ultimately from Sanatana Dharma!